Scandal with JOSELYN DUMAS. Interview
ALEX ROMAN, the former co-owner of SHANSON FM-radio station in Ukraine:
“Dalil Iskandar, who is the friend of mine, asked me to make this interview. Our conversation was recorded in Russian and then it was translated into English by my colleagues. I am sure it will be entertaining to read it!”
What connects you with Mrs. Dumas? What kind of relationship are you in?
We were negotiating with Mrs. Dumas only about JD FOODS project.
What is this project about?
My Dalil Trading Group Company is engaged in the development of the brands for celebrities. If someone wants to create his own brand, we can do it.
What exactly are you doing? What is your work process?
Well, let's use Joselyn's project as example to give you an idea.
Ok, tell us about it.
We got in touch with Joselyn Dumas through our agent. I prepared a letter to her with a proposal to create her own brand of food products. She liked the idea, and we negotiated via Skype. We discussed details, what products we can sell and the way to sell them. Joselyn asked for a contract. We prepared it and sent it for consideration and signing. She considered and signed. We congratulated each other. We began to work, preparing the first offers for products supply. And then the things went wrong.
What exactly went wrong?
Actually, the problems started from the very consideration of the contract by the Ghanaian side. First, her lawyer spoiled the contract which we prepared, then during the whole week the agent were coming to Joselyn with the papers for signing, and she were spoiling them, putting her signature in the wrong place. I could pay attention to all this, but I repeatedly convinced myself that Joselyn simply does not have enough time, that she does not have enough experience, that with my help she will be able to sort the things out. And only later it became clear that the problem was in my partner.
What products were you going to sell under JD FOODS brand?
There is a very good producer of sausages in my trading group. They are the best in Ukraine. This is the largest meat factory in the country; they have more than 150 kinds of products. In addition, we offer hard and soft cheeses, long-shelf milk, butter, spreads, milk powder, pasta products, flour, canned goods and other products. Yes, and we offer Pakistani long-grain rice, of course. Our partner is one of the best producers in the region.
And what happened then? Have you started to supply products?
We approached the first delivery, but did not make it.
Why?
Joselyn refused to work under the contract.
Tell us more about it.
We had several options for work. At first it was necessary to study the Ghanaian market, to understand the taxation in detail, conditions for the import of products into the country, customs duties, specifics of the licensing system and other aspects. When we figured all these things out and got known the retail prices for products, I invited Mrs. Dumas to the Skype conference again to offer opening her own retail JD FOODS store instead of selling our products through retail chains. I figured out that selling at retail is three times more profitable than selling products through retail chains.
Three times more profitable, isn’t it? Are you saying that retail stores make a triple mark-up?
Yes they do, for some goods. Let me explain on the example of pasta products.
Ok.
Supermarket is ready to buy a packet of spaghetti from us for 4 GHS. The retail price of such spaghetti is 14 Cedi. The store earns 10 Cedi. But we grew wheat, we ground it into flour, we made pasta from this flour, packed it, brought it to Ghana on the ship, cleared it, sold it, paid taxes and earned a little more. And we did all this for 4 Cedi.
Yes, indeed, the difference is enormous. So what? You suggested opening a retail store to compete with supermarkets?
You know, my goal is not to compete with others; my goal is to offer people a high-quality product at an affordable price. In general, I build a business such a way that all participants received only pleasure in working process with my company. And it is quite possible. I and Joselyn earn money on these sales, and we are happy. In addition to our profit, Joselyn owns her own brand, which increases her popularity among her fans. We buy products from the supplier who is happy to increase his manufacturing. His employees are happy, because they got salaries and bonuses, after the sales. The carriers are also happy, whose transport we hire to deliver products to Ghana. Both countries receive incomes from taxes and customs duties. This money goes to hospitals, schools, to pay salaries and aids. The people whom we invite to our work and pay salaries are also happy. Believe me, there are very good salaries. And, in the end, the buyers are happy, because they buy tasty and high-quality products at affordable prices. This is an ideal business scheme in which everyone is happy.
And what went wrong in this ideal scheme?
Human factor. Of course, I can only suppose that someone from Joselyn side wedged into our relationship and decided to prevent from our cooperation.
What profit should have you got for your work?
We should have to divide the profit by 50/50 percents.
And before making a profit, what did you earn in this project?
My company does not earn a cent on this project until we get a profit from sales.
That is, your company was working free of charge with the project for several months, didn’t it?
Yes we did, exactly. And I offered this contract to Ms. Dumas by myself to protect her finances and not to take a cent from her until I proved that my scheme was working and making a profit. This was a guarantee of the effectiveness of my offer.
So now when the project had been stopped, all your work was turned out to be unpaid, was it so?
Yes. I can earn only after my partner makes a profit. And it all could work if Joselyn listened to me, without listening the whisper of the enviers.
So, did it mean that someone interfered?
I can just guess. You would better ask Mrs. Dumas about it. In case if she wants to be frank...
And about what profit did you announce? Tell us if it’s not a secret, of course.
At the moment I can even tell you the amount. I told Joselyn about the net profit of 500 thousands US dollars in the first year of our work. It is 250 thousands for each side.
Wow! Yes this is really good money! So after the last negotiations was the final decision to open the store?
Yes. But in the process of preparation and negotiations with suppliers it was found out that it would be impossible to get those grace periods which I expected at the beginning. And the amount of investment in the goods would be enormous. That's why I and Joselyn decided to start with a small step, just with pasta products. We began to prepare for the first supply.
Ok, you will tell about pasta more but first I want to figure things out with financing.
Ok, sure.
You should get half of the profit, and who should invest money in the goods?
According to the contract terms my partner should.
Do you mean, Joselyn Dumas?
In JD FOODS project, yes, that's her.
Do you invest your own money into this project?
No, my company provides the project with all the work, and the partner's side pays all the expenses and is engaged in advertising of its own brand.
Doesn’t it seem to you that under such 50% of the profit conditions are a high percentage for a party that does not bear any financial costs?
You know, in business, no one relies on such concepts as “it seems”. I will tell you that I offer the partner an unreasonably high percentage of the project.
That is, you should receive more than 50% without investing money?
You are surprised in vain. You could calculate by yourself. If I invited an investor to this project, I would pay him no more than 15% of the profit. I would hire a celebrity who would become a face of a trademark paying to her just 10%. And I would give 10% for advertising. This is 35% of the profit totally. In our case I offered 50%. I'm too extravagant in this project...
So why did you ask Joselyn Dumas to cooperate, if you could work with the investor or even by yourself?
I have several reasons. First, I wanted my partner to love his product, as I love it. I wanted Joselyn to take every package of spaghetti as her own property. I wanted her to enjoy this work. And then people would believe her, watching this fire in her eyes, seeing this love to the product and attention to the buyers. And they would buy our products. No one investor will care so much of the brand of other owner. For all of them it’s just business.
Secondly, getting an investor to work in Africa is quite difficult. People do not want to invest money here. They know about the problems that I faced now.
What problems did you face?
Joselyn refused to fulfill the terms of the contract. First, she refused to pay for the delivery of pasta samples to Ghana. These samples had to be checked in the laboratory and after this we had to get the permission to import the product to Ghana.
Why did she refuse?
I will quote her letter to me: “I do not intend to spend a dime in this whole process. The whole idea of marketing and selling products in Ghana is an expensive venture and I have been brought here. Insofar if my principal is not willing to commit funds to the process of getting the products in Ghana among other things, I am not obliged to take on myself that task. You (the principal) must show a bit more commitment financially than you are doing now"
In addition to the fact that Joselyn refused to fulfill her obligations in this letter, she has been continued to call my company “Principal” for two months, although it is clearly written in our contract that her company is the Principal, and my side is the Agent performing for the Principal the whole number of services. The same mistake was made by both of her lawyers, who were preparing the contract for signing. It is out of my understanding.
It is really strange situation. And did you refuse to take some part of the expenses for yourself?
Now I will quote the paragraph 3.3.11 of our contract:
“Principal undertakes:
3.3.11. pay all services associated with the start-up of JD FOODS functioning, until it is impossible to carry out such payments from profits received from JD FOODS functioning. These services include: the production of the original models for the packaging of the Principal products, production of packaging for advertising samples, filling and packaging of promotional samples, express delivery of advertising samples to Ghana, renting a showroom for the presentation of JD FOOD goods, advertising in The media, manufacturing packaging for the first supply of goods to Ghana, payment of logistics services, customs and other expenses. All payments made by the Principal at its own expense, are considered as JD FOODS lending and received by JD FOODS through monthly payments, but not more than 30% of the net profit of the current month”
This paragraph clearly shows not only that Joselyn’s company as Principal shall pay such expenses, but it is also clear that the amount of all payments made will subsequently be returned to her company. It's just lending of her business. I will repeat once again: lending of her business! She pays for permits to sell products under her own brand. And she takes money back from the profits.
And why did Joselyn refuse? What reasons did she give?
I will answer this question quoting her lawyer's letter to me dated April 6, 2017: “Unfortunately, there is a clear misconception as to her obligations under the contract. My client agrees that there is some cost involved in the licensing of products in Ghana, my client did not anticipate the least of the colossal nature of the cost. The cost ranges from GHc5000.00 to about US $ 20,000.00 I have been informed by my client that the charges are in the way of the food and the drugs. Please note that this letter refers to the amount from 5 thousand cedi to 20 thousand dollars. But already in the next letter the lawyer wrote this to me: Secondly per clause 2.4 of the contract. My client has some reason for you. For the avoidance of doubt I want to state it unreservedly that my client does not have the wherewithal. An amount of $ 20,000 is way above the company's capability. The company is also in a position to secure a loan facility. These are the reasons that are valid enough and I deem it as a barrier in the performance of the obligations” This letter is dated April 18, 2017. And I assure you that nothing has changed in the Ghanaian legislation in these 12 days. Here is an excerpt from REGISTRATION REQUIREMENTS - Imported Food Products:
We can see that for permission to import pasta products, and in this case we are talking about import of pasta products from Egypt, Joselyn shall pay 400 cedi annually and 1800 cedi once every three years. And the amount of 20 thousand dollars refers to canned meat, meat and fish products, and baby food. We do not import anything of these goods… In addition, this information was provided to me by Joselyn’s assistant. He sent a copy of these requirements of the law to Joselyn and so did we. But in his letter the lawyer justified the refusal to fulfill the terms of the contract by the Ghanaian side with the amount of 20 thousand dollars. Whether the lawyer was deceived, or whether he began to appeal precisely this amount from personal motives. But the fact is: Joselyn’s side knows that she should pay only 2,200 Ghanaian cedi plus the cost of samples delivery from Egypt to Ghana. In fact, it is the amount of about 800 dollars. And so it's strange for me to read this phrase from my partner's side: “For the avoidance of doubt, I want to state it unreservedly that my client does not have the wherewithal" It turns out that Joselyn Dumas is a poor actress who signed a contract, which she couldn't fulfill at all. Then why did she sign? But I am reading in the network that this actress is not so poor. Look at this photo from the article:
There is net worth of 400,000 USD. I do not like to count other people's money. I'm not interested in it. But I also do not like it when partners refuse to fulfill their obligations.
But if it's a question of such a small amount, why do not you make concessions and pay at least a half?
If I take the obligations of my partner upon myself, then why did we need this contract? Why do we need all negotiations and contracts, if one of the sides doesn’t want to fulfill the obligations? Furthermore we are only an agent providing services. We don’t manage the bank account, so it means we don’t manage the received profit from which we could take our funds back if we paid. According to our contract only Joselyn can do all this.
But if you don’t make concessions now then you risk losing your partner in the person of Joselyn Dumas.
She's the worst partner in my life. Nobody ever in my practice refused to fulfill the terms of the contract simply without any reason. If people sign contracts to make a profit, they try to find the ways to fulfill their obligations. And in case with Joselyn, I faced not just a refusal to fulfill her obligations, but also an attempt to shift the blame to my shoulders. And this fact offends me much more than stories about the poverty of the famous Ghanaian actress. By the way, poverty, even it is true, is not a barrier in this case. Here is the paragraph from our contract:
“The Principal has the right to:
3.4.3. To get bank loans to make payments for the promotion and operation of JD FOODS trademark”
That’s why I am saying again, Joselyn’s poverty that her lawyer claims about in his letter, is not a hindrance to build a successful business under JD FOODS project. It is always possible to apply to the bank for a loan.
You told that Joselyn wanted to shuffle off the blame on to you. What does it mean?
Here is what her lawyer wrote to me on 6th of April: “I am also informed by my client that she has consistently reminded you of the cost implication and charges and enquired from you on numerous occasions as to who is to bear the cost and charges but you ingeniously avoided this particular subject matter”
This is what I mean: the contract was signed on 18th of February. It is clearly specified in the contract that it is Joselyn’s side that makes all the payments. It was her lawyer who prepared the contract to sign. Then Joselyn was getting ready to start work with full interest from 18th of February till March 31. Here is the screen shot of her letter from 31st of March:
Then all of them did not answer our letters and calls for 5 days, and on 5th of April Joselyn wrote us that she didn’t plan to pay anything. Here is the screen shot of her letter:
And here is the screen shot of the contract with Joselyn’s signature:
And now let’s renew the words: “I am also informed by my client that she has consistently reminded you of the cost implication and charges and enquired from you on numerous occasions as to who is to bear the cost and charges but you ingeniously avoided this particular subject matter”
Tell me now, how is it possible to sign the contract on 18th of February with the participation of the lawyer, and then in a month and a half with the aid of the same lawyer to accuse me that I ingeniously avoided answering the question, who would pay the expenses?
Yes, it is not absolutely clear.
And I do not understand.
I noticed that on these copies some names are hidden. Did you do that intentionally?
Yes, I do not want to mention the names of Joselyn's assistants. They are all young people; their whole life is before them. And such unprofessional actions, with which they together with Joselyn destroyed my JD FOODS project, can spoil their further career. If they all are intelligent people, it will be enough for them to read this interview and understand their mistakes. But if Joselyn decides to sue me by any reasons, I will publish all the names and all copies of correspondence with this freaking team.
I see. Let’s renew the subject who shall pay. Here I have your first letter to Joselyn Dumas. There is such a phrase here: “And the most important moment of my project: you do not invest your money in the purchase of food. I have created the work scheme without investment. Dalil Trading Group works such a way. And this is the uniqueness of JD FOODS project"
Yes, there was such a letter in January.
You said that Joselyn didn’t have to pay anything. And then it turned out that she should. Maybe this was the reason of refusing the project.
Firstly, this letter was drawn up a month and a half before the signing of the contract. The contract specifies in detail all the responsibilities of each of the sides, who should pay and what should be paid for. Secondly, it was said in the letter that she should not pay for food. She should not pay exactly for the products. And there is really such a way with different suppliers. For example, a sausage manufacturer gives deferment of the payment. Manufacturers really want to enter the Ghanaian market. But in this letter, I was speaking not just deferment of the payment about. There I said about the role of an agent between the manufacturers and outlet chains. This is the agent under JD FOODS trademark. We can organize our work in such a way that, thanks to the low price for products and the popularity of Joselyn’s brand, the retailer will agree to prepay for the goods, and we will transfer this money to the manufacturer. This all are the details of negotiations, which I am not going to reveal here. I know how to get the buyer’s interest. I know how to reduce taxes in a legal way. And this is a huge savings for my partners including retailers in case of high sales volume. But working with Joselyn, we were not even a mile closer to the sales. Besides the accountant, that Joselyn appointed for consultations, doesn’t know the difference between VAT and profit tax.
How can you dodge taxes in a “lawful manner”?
You distorted my words on a flat surface. I did not say “dodge taxes”. It is a crime. I spoke about the possibility of a lawful reduction of tax obligations. These are different things.
Ok. So, could Joselyn not pay for the purchase of products?
Yes, she could. It is possible for some products, under some special conditions. But it's easier to take a loan if she do not have her money, and work with prepayment. Then the purchase price will be lower.
What are these “special conditions”?
There are different ways of deferment of the payment for goods. Under export conditions, we often can work on letters of credit with a bank guarantee of the contract performance. In addition we can have arrangements for deferment with suppliers. And we can have short-term bank lending as well. But there are some goods that can be purchased only on a prepayment basis such as cheese, butter and milk powder.
I see. But I still cannot agree with you on one issue. You can pay these 800 dollars and continue to work? Or is this just matter of principle?
Kindly understand, if I pay now, then I will have to pay further. Joselyn will understand that she can just not fulfill the signed conditions, and there will be no punishment for that. But we are not a married couple, where partners can just be capricious. We are business partners who have accepted obligations and who should trust each other. Well, tell me, how can I trust her the goods for 200 thousand dollars? That's how much one sausage container costs. Yes, the manufacturer is ready to give deferment of the payment. But how can I risk having such an irresponsible partner? And what if Joselyn does not want to pay for this sausage after the sale? And what if she does not want to pay the carrier? How can I explain all these caprices to my suppliers? After all, the biggest loss that I bear today from her refusal is my reputation. Here, for example, the problem happened with the Egyptian pasta supplier. We had been negotiating for more than two weeks and finally, I arrived to the factory in Cairo. We selected pasta samples together with the manager for sending them to the Ghanaian laboratory. There was also an unpleasant situation. I need to tell you the details of the situation which happened to me because of the fault of the Ghanaian partners.
Yes, tell me please.
You saw in the extract from the law that it was necessary to provide 6 samples to examine them. Joselyn’s assistant insisted that we needed to provide 6 packs of each type of pasta. That is, we wanted to start selling 6 kinds of pasta products: spaghetti, pasta, noodles and others. All these kinds are supplied from one manufacturer and are made from the similar grade of flour. All products have the similar package. The difference is only in the shape of pasta. I came to the factory in Cairo and asked them to give me 6 types, each of 6 packs. The manager told me that was not necessary. Their factory supplies pasta to Ghana monthly with 5 containers of products. They work with different buyers, and none of them asked to provide them with 15 kilograms of samples for examination. It is enough pasta to feed the whole Ministry! I had to persuade him without arguing with my Ghanaian partners to fulfill their request. We collected almost 15 kilograms of pasta; put 2 boxes in the office of the director awaiting the arrival of the courier from the delivery service.
I left the factory and called my interpreter to inform her with the address for the courier. Joselyn’s assistant should have called the delivery service to receive an invoice for payment, to pay and wait for the courier service to bring samples from Egypt to Ghana. All this takes not more than 4 days. And what do you think?
I don’t know. What?
Nobody took the samples. No one called the courier service. On 28th of March we sent to Joselyn’s assistant the address of the factory. On 31st of March I received a letter from Joselyn that I already showed you:
“Dear Dalil,
Apologies for the inconvenience. My assistant is getting in touch with Alesya as soon as possible to get the delivery information.
Thanks”
Then it was 5 days of complete silence. They did not answer our calls and letters...
Who? Joselyn?
Yes, of course, Joselyn. She takes all the decisions by herself. And then on 5th of April there was a letter with her refuse to pay.
And how did the Egyptian manufacturer react to this?
He did not answer both of my letters, and in a telephone conversation he just said: I see.
It is unpleasant situation!
No, it's not just unpleasant situation! This is a damage of the partnership with our Egyptian supplier. This is a collapse in confidence. We lost a major Egyptian manufacturer with the best quality and the best price of the product. This is an irreplaceable loss. And this loss is not the only one.
Who else did you set back?
Well, we didn’t take other samples for this project yet, but relations were spoiled with the English shipping carrier, who compiled our delivery calculations and was going to start working with us in April. Relations with the sausage manufacturer in Ukraine became strained. They offered great conditions for us. They offered not only a delay in payment and a huge discount, but they were also willing to pay half of that sum of 20 thousand dollars just to start deliveries to Ghana. But there are no discussions now. There is no contract.
So did you terminate the contract with Joselyn?
No. There is a ridiculous situation. The lawyer asks me to agree to terminate the contract, but they do not send me a letter of termination. That is, I should agree with something that they did not offer. They don’t act their age really.
So what do you think? Why did it all happen?
It's hard for me to guess. I do not know who is next to Joselyn, what they are discussing. I can only talk according to the facts from email correspondence, phone conversations and Skype negotiations. And these facts show the complete incompetence of her team, and Joselyn's unwillingness to comply with the terms of the contract she signed. Everything is clear in this phrase: “I do not intend to spend a dime in this whole process".
But how is it possible to make a profit of 250 thousand dollars without investing a cent, without doing any work and fulfilling the terms of the contract? May be it is possible if she makes a wish for Santa Claus...
Yes, this is unpleasant situation.
I will tell you more. This is an unacceptable situation in doing business. Such relationships show the negative view not only about my partner, but about the whole country, about the entire African continent. Most of my suppliers refused to give products with a deferred payment precisely because I work with West Africa. The English investment company did not even consider my business plan. They simply replied that they do not finance projects in West Africa, because, I quote: "it is impossible to build a business there". And now I understand what exactly these people meant. There is no way of just refusing the contract after three months of our hard work on how to make more money for Joselyn with minimal investment. It was three months of my company's work; it was three months of my life. I'm not so rich and not so young to waste whole seasons from my own life.
And what do you expect from Joselyn Dumas now?
I do not expect anything good from her. I cannot understand her logic at all. The lawyer asks to agree with the contract termination without providing an official letter of termination. What is it? Is it Joselyn's lack of professionalism? Is it a lack of professionalism of her lawyer? Or is it a fear of asking for the contract termination because she understands her guilt? I do not know, I do not understand...
If they send a letter of termination, will you sign it?
When they send, then I will see...
Why did you decide to address the journalists? Why can you not solve all the problems with Joselyn or her lawyer?
So they do not answer my letters. How can I solve any issue with them?
I still want to understand why Joselyn refused this work. After all, it is clear that she refused it not because of 800 dollars.
Well, if you understand, it's good. I'm not sure. Maybe it is exactly because of 800 dollars.
Or maybe, Joselyn still thinks she has to pay 20 thousand dollars?
I have no idea what she thinks. I have the facts. Her assistant works with her. He sent me an excerpt from the law on the amount of the payments. If he is not able to explain to Joselyn how much she should pay, then probably this is the problem of Joselyn herself and her inability to select her employees. The first lawyer that she introduced to me ruined the contract, which we had been preparing for 6 days. Her accountant was unable to fill in the elementary table of taxation like: we bought-sold-paid taxes-received a profit. Her assistant could not correctly understand how many samples we should provide and how much they should pay for them. He didn’t get it after reading thorough information from the FDA official document. Her lawyer had been composing letters for two weeks, and then he said that he represented Joselyn Dumas, and then suddenly represented not her, but her company. And then he disappeared again for the whole month. And what can we earn with such a team, if we suppose that the contract can be renewed? After all, these people manage the bank account. How can I entrust them goods for 20 thousand dollars, 200 thousand dollars or per million dollars?
And did you try to talk with the lawyer about the payments? Did you try to explain him that they only needed to pay 800 dollars, but not 20 thousand?
I mean the communication with a lawyer is not negotiations. Joselyn left the negotiations in the beginning of April and instructed the lawyer to terminate our contract. He is not here to understand who is right and who is wrong. He will simply carry out the task given to him. So why should I explain something to him? I shouldn’t, especially if he does not ask...
Ok. The last question is: what do you want to achieve with this interview?
I understand that Joselyn Dumas has influence and popularity in Ghana. People’s opinion about my company and about me personally can depend from one of her word. In order to avoid any conjectures about our work, I am telling the whole story openly about the contract that has been stopped, but not terminated yet. I like Ghana. This is a promising country for work. I do not want to lose this market just because I unsuccessfully picked up the first partner. I am sure that there are a lot of decent businessmen, actors and investors in Ghana who are ready to invest in interesting projects.
We offer not only food products. We offer the development of tobacco brands; we can supply agricultural equipment and cultivate of agricultural products according to the order of the buyer and we offer other kinds of partnership. I declare that we can sell quality food products in Ghana at the lowest price. And besides, my friend is the best sound editor in Ukraine. And he could bring the Ghanaian cinema to a new level of sound recording. This is the thing that not only Ghanaian films need but Nigerian films as well but this is an issue for another conversation...
Joselyn Dumas about opening own JD FOODS shop:
About JD FOODS project:
